soltero

They shouldn't. And, it gets hairier: Some unscrupulous real estate agents and developers will *tell* you the property is titled, and maybe even show you a title, but after you pay your money and then go to register the property, you find that there's someone else with a title ahead of you. Best bet -- especially on the Atlantic side, where land fraud seems to be more rampant -- is to hire your own, independent lawyer (not the agent's) to do a title search for you -- before you hand over any money.

cognitive

What about buying an apartment in a town and not some land ? would that property entitle me to the same rights as a Panamanian citizen?
And what exactly is the type of visa I would need to do that ? Can I come with a visitor one and then purchase the apartment and apply for a change of status ?

soltero

Property is property -- it doesn't matter if it's land or an apartment. However, get over that "same rights as a Panamanian citizen" part. You are not going to have the same rights as a Panamanian citizen until you ARE a citizen (and that's a long process). Getting a visa does not make you a citizen.

To buy the property, you do not need a visa; lots of people do it when they're visiting Panama on their 90-day turista tarjeta (which is free or $5, depending on what country you're coming from). You can apply for your visa at any future point -- or never. There are many people here who own property and simply enter and re-enter the country as tourists; you can "recharge" your tourist card with a 72-hour hop over to Costa Rica, for example. (However, the government is trying to crack down on these permanent tourists; this has been discussed elsewhere in this forum.) Basically, you should start the visa application process when you are certain you want to live here, or spend more than 90 days here every year.

As far as type of visa: That's impossible to say without knowing your individual circumstances and desires. Do you have a lifetime pension? Do you have $40K to invest in a reforestation project? Do you plan to invest at least $200K in your property?

MRWOOHOO

In regards to ROP (right of possession) land. I personally feel, and so does my attorney, that if you know what you are doing you are fine. There are some areas I would not purchase ROP (such as Bocas) but in many other areas there is not much of a problem. Once again this depends on how good (and honest) of an attorney somebody has. I actually just met with my attorney today. He informed me he can get a title on a good ROP property within 53 days. Once again due diligence needs to be handled. Many times the reason people's property is ROP is that they dont have the money to title it. They do have legal rights to the property that I believe were granted to them from the department of agriculture. As a side note my attorney informed me he is telling prospective investors currently not to buy ANYTHING in Panama.

soltero

Hmm. I guess we can agree to disagree. The fallacy I see with your argument: If you agree that it's dangerous to buy ROP property in Bocas, why would it not be dangerous elsewhere? Just because you have a good feeling about the person you're dealing with?

Yes, I agree that with a good lawyer (or two) and lots of on-the-ground legwork it is certainly possible to buy ROP property and not get burned. Hundreds (or thousands) have done it. But if you're not living in Panama, and you don't speak Spanish, and you don't have a long-standing working relationship with a Panama attorney, and you don't want to put in hundreds of hours in research and hundreds of dollars in additional fees -- or any combination of the above -- I'd look for titled property only.

Remember, Woohoo, the OP and most people here are out-of-towners who've read a pro-Panama article in some Frozen Tundra Suburb, or maybe attended a pro-Panama seminar, and now they're eager to jump on the "Live Like A King on a Sandy Beach with Beautiful Babes for Only a Dollar a Day" bandwagon. Those kind of buyers should *not* be steered toward ROP property, imho.

MRWOOHOO

I guess when you put it that way I agree. If you are brand new at the Panama land game and don't know who you are dealing with you may not want to venture into the ROP property realm. The reason I recommend steering clear of Bocas is due to the amount of what seems to be ongoing attempts to snatch land that is even titled, let alone ROP. I feel VERY fortunate about the people I have done business with. That includes real estate agent, miscellaneous connections, and I LOVE MY ATTORNEY!!! Good observation and obviously experience.

cognitive

I would have those money if I sell all my proprieties here , but I wouldn't do that just to obtain a Panama resident visa if my life will not be better off there. Besides, I would be expecting to have the same rights as a Panamanian after moving there and applying for citizenship . By the way , how long would it takes to have the right to apply for this status ?

soltero

I suggest you start a new thread to explore the visa question -- this one's getting too long and is wildly unfocused. But for a good summary of available visas, look at Panama Offshore Legal's site: http://www.panama-offshore-services....tion_visas.htm

crooked69

Very good info from everybody. This is a great forum. The recent comments lead me back to MrWoohoo's advise for me a few weeks ago. Don't rush to buy something, move here first, maybe rent for a while. Talk to people, learn the lay of the land and politics and you'll be better informed before making said purchase. I had planned on coming back there in July with my check book but now I think I might leave it at home and look around a bit more.

Latortura

I believe that with a cheaper cost of living, great weather and great taxation laws, these preriquisites alone make Panama a great candidate for retiring too, whether as an early retiree or later one, doesn't matter. Also for those that want to set up shop there I am sure the opportunities for furhter developement are endless if you have a humble approach and a good imagination.

Latortura

My Parents are going to visti Panama for at least three months before takinng the ultimate plunge. It is a big decision to move and going just for a couple of weeks won't give you a good idea. A short let in a house and travelling around and doing what the Locals do is the best way to get the best judgement. This also gives you a chance to travel far and wide before determining the best place to live that suits you best.

Nat

I am gonna leave Canada for Panama and I hope it will worth it! My bro is already there and he keep telling me it's paradise on earth !!!

MRWOOHOO

Hi Nat, I am guessing from your other postings that you are from Quebec? I spent allot of time there myself and always enjoyed it. Unless of course it was February and then it was to cold. If you like fun, sun, rain, and humidity you will enjoy Panama.

Salude and Welcome

BEL-AIR

"Virtually every Panama law has different stipulations for foreigners and true citizens; gun ownership, for example."

AcAN A PERSON WITH A PERM RESIDENT VISA OWN A FIREARM? opps sorry caps... jusy wondering the rules there...

Nat

Yes, MRWOOHOO, i'm from Québec city !!!

GeekZ

I really like Panama, but honestly the thought of leaving my family and friends is quite difficult.

PanamaIRP

Good question. Living in Panama has many benefits. First, the US is getting very expensive by all standards and wages are not keeping up. Also, I am not sure for how long, but Panama also has a moratorium on taxes, it has a stable currency and government with favorable incorporation laws and its only a couple hours by plane from the US or to any of the great countries in South America.

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Panama Real Estate

Panamax

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"Few cities in Latin America can match the diversity, cosmopolitanism and sheer energy of Panama City..." - THE ROUGH GUIDE

panamaparadise

How can UK citizen move to Panama?
Is it easy to get a business and get easy Visa?
Also what are the best places to live right now?
Also what are the best property sites to buy property in Panama?

MRWOOHOO

I have many great memories from Quebec. When you make it down give me a shout and I will buy you a Molson, Eh!

Panamax

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"Few cities in Latin America can match the diversity, cosmopolitanism and sheer energy of Panama City..." - THE ROUGH GUIDE