Thread: How possible is it that we could see civil unrest in Panama in the next year or so?

One could interpret the economic news very negatively if one paid any attention to it. Prices for basics are on the increase such as food and fuel. They are increasing at an alarming rate. Panamanians are not in a position to absorb these price increases indefinitely. What are the chances of seeing widespread civil unrest here such as we are seeing in other parts of the world? Panamanian families already spend a significant percentage of their take home pay on food and basics? Or, do you believe that this is just non-sense and that Panamanians will just accept additional burdens quietly. Maybe they will just eat more plantains to fill up their stomachs and stay calm and friendly?

good subject poller , yes there will be unrest in panama , there is already in the city about gas and bus/taxi fares , lots of people have no real idea about what is going on the world , as they believe the talking heads on cable news , there is a ton of good news blogs but most people are busy in their lives watching dancing with the stars , the reason on the huge price increases are the FED , they have devalued the dollar 97% since 1913 . and if Q3 happens , and most think it almost has to , to try and kick the can down the road a little bit more ,then the end of the dollar will come a lot sooner than most are ready for . when we wake up some morning and find our flat is worthless then the chit will hit the fan . the day that happens everyone will wish they had done more to prepare. everyone knows Hitler was in power , not many know why he was elected into power . Germany went thru hell before he was elected . it will not only be the people here , it will be anyone holding US flat a very good read is a little 161 page pdf called when money dies , here is a link , http://www.wolf1168.us/misc/Articles...ney%20Dies.pdf , i believe everyone of us should be stocking up on 3 things , food , gold/silver and lead . it is better to have and not need than to need and not have . people can get real ugly when their family is starving . and every gringo , nomatter how poor we are, looks rich to them . people here in panama have a edge as the weather lets you grow food all year . a little hard in montana .what the answer is , i have no idea , but we can prepare a little just to be ready , most locals do not have the knowledge that we have about world affairs as they only watch the local news and do not read enough english to read the news blogs we can , one i really enjoy is zerohedge.com

I did see a small protest of 5 people on the road to playa blanca. I couldn't read their signs, but my guess was either gas or food prices. There were two police officers standing next to them so it looked well contained and healthy. When's the last time I've seen a protest in NYC? Never. When the Panamanian president screws up, there is a protest, and a reverse in policy. The people do have a voice, even if contained. I'd argue that is much more healthy that the state of the US. Will there be anger over inflation? It's already evident. Will there be violent rioting and revolution like in Cairo? I'm betting no.

Originally Posted by skynet21

I did see a small protest of 5 people on the road to playa blanca. I couldn't read their signs, but my guess was either gas or food prices. There were two police officers standing next to them so it looked well contained and healthy. When's the last time I've seen a protest in NYC? Never. When the Panamanian president screws up, there is a protest, and a reverse in policy. The people do have a voice, even if contained. I'd argue that is much more healthy that the state of the US. Will there be anger over inflation? It's already evident. Will there be violent rioting and revolution like in Cairo? I'm betting no.

i think the protest at playa blanca is over the burning at the garbage dump , lots has been posted on Winners site about the promise to stop and it has not , from what i have read it is almost unliveable there because of the smoke ,

Just before carnival this year I did see a very large protest on Avenue Balboa, it closed the road off in the morning for over 2 hours, I later found out it was about mining

Panama is not excluded from the effects of global economics, shortage of resources, including the rising cost of food. It is entirely possible that there will be 'uprisings' over the lack of accessibility to 'cheap food' in Panama - so far no country on the planet has escaped the effects higher food prices. Although not a major factor, the cost of food was an element in the Middle East "awakening', particularly due to the failure of wheat crop in Russia and Ukraine.

When food shortages/higher prices hit nations like Mexico where the staple diet consists of tortillas, there are going to be 'ripples'. There is little doubt water is going to be the oil of the future.

In Panama there is quite a bit of locally produced food. But, this locally produced food is also going up with the price of fuel. As fuel continues to go up so will the locally produced food. Wages are stagnant of course here. Imported goods will go up the most. And, a lot of the imported foods can just be avoided. There is no such thing as "cheap food" in the third world. Luckily, at least in the interior, there doesn't seem to be a problem with water supplies. An ordinary family spends at least 50% of income on food alone in the interior of the country. There isn't much flexibility for absorbing inflationary food pricing here.

Originally Posted by Pollerkeeper

In Panama there is quite a bit of locally produced food. But, this locally produced food is also going up with the price of fuel. As fuel continues to go up so will the locally produced food. Wages are stagnant of course here. Imported goods will go up the most. And, a lot of the imported foods can just be avoided. There is no such thing as "cheap food" in the third world. Luckily, at least in the interior, there doesn't seem to be a problem with water supplies. An ordinary family spends at least 50% of income on food alone in the interior of the country. There isn't much flexibility for absorbing inflationary food pricing here.

Reports I've read indicate no unemployment in Panama. (From a practical standpoint, this means everyone who wants a job has one and in fact some skilled positions are going unfilled). Therefore, it is predicted that wages will rise. I realize increased labor costs can mean increased costs for goods and services, but based on what I know Panamanians earn, I hope their burden is eased (or at least not worsened) by wage increases. I can't believe I said this.

Based on what I know the wages go like this in the interior. Labor is 12 bucks/day. Semi-skilled is 15 to 18 bucks/day. Skilled labor is 25 bucks/day. There are many who work for much less. Most do not have steady employment. They work just enough.

Panamanian unemployment is a great example of the old saying "there are lies, blatant lies and statistics".

The government figures are based on the people who go to the Ministerio de Trabajo looking for a job.

How many from the interior will even bother when it means a trip to the PC?

There are no local offices and no benefits or help.

So half the population of the country just make do with whatever they can find for themselves locally and never get into the statistics.

Rik

Originally Posted by BalaBeacher

Reports I've read indicate no unemployment in Panama. (From a practical standpoint, this means everyone who wants a job has one and in fact some skilled positions are going unfilled). Therefore, it is predicted that wages will rise. I realize increased labor costs can mean increased costs for goods and services, but based on what I know Panamanians earn, I hope their burden is eased (or at least not worsened) by wage increases. I can't believe I said this.

I take it most Panama farmers have switched to genetically modified seeds of the multi-national agribusiness?

Originally Posted by Pollerkeeper

Based on what I know the wages go like this in the interior. Labor is 12 bucks/day. Semi-skilled is 15 to 18 bucks/day. Skilled labor is 25 bucks/day. There are many who work for much less. Most do not have steady employment. They work just enough.

What would someone in the interior make working at a phone store, mcdonalds, or a bank? It is really a hard thing to grasp.

Originally Posted by nakedguydb

good subject poller , yes there will be unrest in panama , there is already in the city about gas and bus/taxi fares , lots of people have no real idea about what is going on the world , as they believe the talking heads on cable news , there is a ton of good news blogs but most people are busy in their lives watching dancing with the stars , the reason on the huge price increases are the FED , they have devalued the dollar 97% since 1913 . and if Q3 happens , and most think it almost has to , to try and kick the can down the road a little bit more ,then the end of the dollar will come a lot sooner than most are ready for . when we wake up some morning and find our flat is worthless then the chit will hit the fan . the day that happens everyone will wish they had done more to prepare. everyone knows Hitler was in power , not many know why he was elected into power . Germany went thru hell before he was elected . it will not only be the people here , it will be anyone holding US flat a very good read is a little 161 page pdf called when money dies , here is a link , http://www.wolf1168.us/misc/Articles...ney%20Dies.pdf , i believe everyone of us should be stocking up on 3 things , food , gold/silver and lead . it is better to have and not need than to need and not have . people can get real ugly when their family is starving . and every gringo , nomatter how poor we are, looks rich to them . people here in panama have a edge as the weather lets you grow food all year . a little hard in montana .what the answer is , i have no idea , but we can prepare a little just to be ready , most locals do not have the knowledge that we have about world affairs as they only watch the local news and do not read enough english to read the news blogs we can , one i really enjoy is zerohedge.com

That link to "when Money Dies" is a must read according to Warren Buffet. He said all persons of means should read it. What is Buffet expecting to happen that only the wealthy need worry about preparing? I read the entire book last year and there are some similarities between what happened then and what is transpiring now.

Originally Posted by BalaBeacher

Reports I've read indicate no unemployment in Panama. (From a practical standpoint, this means everyone who wants a job has one and in fact some skilled positions are going unfilled). Therefore, it is predicted that wages will rise. I realize increased labor costs can mean increased costs for goods and services, but based on what I know Panamanians earn, I hope their burden is eased (or at least not worsened) by wage increases. I can't believe I said this.

Allot of Panama's employment demand is related to infrastructure spending ie the canal expansion, subway and major road building throughout the country. This has a great stimulus effect now but what happens when these projects are complete and the jobs end? Also Panama borrowed money to do these projects that must be paid back. How many Panamanians are banking money and preparing now while times are good?

I believe the last time there was civil unrest here, apart from internal political dealings and canal issues, was due to someone not paying for their water melon properly: Watermelon War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Now that Peru has elected a (former) communist the disease seems to be spreading. Eventually they will do the same here.

So, some of you believe that if we had some very high inflation and families were unable to afford the basics such as food, every thing would remain fine. People would just grow their own vegy's and eat fruits and make their own alcoholic beverages. Panamanians are extremely docile evidently and they carry those machetes strictly for cutting grass. Forgive me for being just a little skeptical about this thinking. And I will definitely watch how I pay for my water melons.

Originally Posted by JustinG

I take it most Panama farmers have switched to genetically modified seeds of the multi-national agribusiness?

god i hope not , if you any study on GMO you will find it is all lies , on average a farmer kills himself ever 1/2 hour in India because of crop failure .about the only good thing that Cheves has ever done was kick Monsato out of the country , and the people of monsanto should be shot , pissed on and then burnt for doing what they are trying to do in this world .

Originally Posted by nakedguydb

god i hope not , if you any study on GMO you will find it is all lies , on average a farmer kills himself ever 1/2 hour in India because of crop failure .about the only good thing that Cheves has ever done was kick Monsato out of the country , and the people of monsanto should be shot , pissed on and then burnt for doing what they are trying to do in this world .

Yes what is happening in India is horrible! Plus those seeds are more reliant on things made from fossil fuels. Making it more expensive to farm. That is why I was asking about Panama.

There is also the negatives effects to your health. Problem is they are not labeled - so most of us eat them everyday without knowing it. Even in the US they don't have to be labeled because they realized many would avoid the foods.

"...the person who was in charge of FDA policy in 1992, Monsanto’s former attorney, Michael Taylor, he allowed GMOs on the market without any safety studies and without labeling, and the policy claimed that the agency was not aware of any information showing that GMOs were significantly different. Seven years later, because of a lawsuit, 44,000 secret internal FDA memos revealed that that policy was a lie. Not only were the scientists at the FDA aware that GMOs were different, they had warned repeatedly that they might create allergies, toxins, new diseases and nutritional problems. But they were ignored, and their warnings were even denied, and the policy went forth allowing the deployment GMOs into the food supply with virtually no safety studies."

Source: WikiLeaks Cables Reveal U.S. Sought to Retaliate Against Europe over Monsanto GM Crops

Another good podcast for those interested:
In Defense of Food: Author, Journalist Michael Pollan on Nutrition, Food Science and the American Diet